Renaissance

March 12th, 2009

Clinton Damage Curable

I’ve been sitting here working on turning my Hillarized Saiga 12 into a functioning shotgun. It’s incredibly frustrating.

I don’t really know if the Clintons are the only ones who caused the problem. Feel free to comment.

It’s impossible to find a gunsmith whom I can trust to take off the gun-ban garbage, within an acceptable time frame. I am trying to get on a wait list, but that will cost me four months, minimum. Therefore I am doing what most Saiga 12 owners do. I am buying parts, and I am going to install them myself. I’ve confirmed that it’s not a major job. The only thing I have to be careful of is marring the gun so the pro I eventually send it to will have to repair the damage.

Here’s how it works. You have to get rid of the insane fire control group that has been put on the gun to move the trigger back and convince idiot bureaucrats that it’s a sporting weapon. That means buying a new fire control group and trigger guard. If you don’t do this, you might as well not even buy the gun. This is the keystone of a Saiga 12 conversion.

You have to remove four pins from the receiver, I believe. Plus a spot weld. Without gouging anything. Then you throw out half the gun’s guts and put the new FCG in. Then you put the new trigger guard on, with screws. And you add a pistol grip. The FCG move allows you to change the stock, which is an abomination straight from hell. You take off the stock, saw the tang off the rear of the receiver, and install something to bolt the new stock to. You can get someone to TIG-weld a back plate on, or you can get an adaptor that attaches to the receiver. The nicer ones go inside. The less-nice ones go outside.

Once you’ve done all that, you can bolt a stock to the rear of the gun. If you want it to fold, you have to add a foldy thing first. Folding is very good, not because you would ever shoot a 12 gauge from the hip, but because a folded gun is easier to store and move.

At this point, a real man would blast the gun with aluminum oxide (NOT sand or glass beads) and add a tough bake-on coating.

When all these things have been done, you have a relatively healthy AK-47 that shoots buckshot. You can add bigger magazines and various doodads.

It’s a giant pain. I wish I knew someone in Miami who could be trusted to TIG-weld the receiver when I’m done, but Miami has a very tiny skilled-labor pool. Oh, if you want something done, you can have it, but 98% of the people who eagerly volunteer won’t know what they’re doing. The conversion will leave several holes in the receiver, and you need a precision welder to fix them. And it’s better to weld on a trigger guard. But you can’t get it done here.

I figure I’ll do what other people do. I’ll put the gun together, and I’ll stick nylon plugs in the holes, and I’ll blue the bits of the gun where bare metal can be seen. Then I’ll take my time looking for a far-off gunsmith who will fix the holes and refinish the weapon. Then I’ll send it to him. It’s hard to find a Saiga rebuilder who has time to do anything, but it’s easy to find a gunsmith who can put the finishing touches on a gun you’ve already converted.

Interesting info: you can get 12-round stick magazines, but for various reasons I don’t completely understand, the 8-round jobs are better. If you’re truly nuts, you can get a drum that holds, I think, 20. There are two competing companies that make these, and they hate each other. They put up feuding videos on Youtube, trashing each other’s products. It seems like MD Arms has, far and away, the better reputation. In case you want to skip all that.

I’m pooped, and I didn’t even do anything yet.

I decided to go with 00 buck for defense purposes. I found a wonderful round that is relatively cheap and outperforms everything else. It will do great things at surprisingly long distances. I don’t care about shooting through walls. Don’t start with me. Houses in Miami are built from concrete blocks. To hit my neighbors, I’d have to go through four thicknesses of concrete.

Now I sit back and wait for UPS. Hope I can pull this off.

10 Responses to “Renaissance”

  1. ot Says:

    Dude, have a jeweler do the welding. Ask three really good antique people who repairs their jewelry and go to that guy. My local guy can laser weld platinum without removing the pearls. Spot weld on a shotgun would be easy.

    In good times you probably couldn’t get him to do it. Now, probably.

    -OT

  2. blindshooter Says:

    “Houses in Miami are built from concrete blocks”

    In that case, 00 is wonderful. I love me a shotgun for home defense.

    Hope the modification goes well. I used to have contacts (Marine Corp) that could do the TIG thing really well. I trusted them to weld lugs on my best M1A receiver back when that weapon was the hot setup for use in High Power competition. I guess all those guys are long gone now. Good gunsmiths are always in demand and always backed up with work.

  3. Rick Says:

    I expect to see you in the news someday.

  4. Ric Locke Says:

    The downside to any large-capacity magazine is always the spring(s).

    Like everything else in engineering, it’s a tradeoff. If the spring is strong enough to feed the last round correctly, it may be so strong when compressed that the first round binds up. If it’s weak enough to feed the first round correctly, it may not be strong enough for the last one to feed properly (or at all, in some cases). The more times you reload it, and therefore cycle the spring, the weaker the spring gets.

    Drum magazines use coiled springs, which if properly designed can provide almost constant force at the feed ramp.

    If experience says the eight-round magazines are more reliable, I’d go with that.

    Regards,
    Ric

  5. Sigivald Says:

    Hell, to riff off of what OT suggested, you don’t need the holes welded shut.

    It’s not like they’re a structural issue, right? They need to be closed up to keep gases in in case of a rupture (does that even happen with shotshells? I guess it could, in theory.) and to keep dirt out.

    You can just silver-solder over the hole with some sheet, and re-blue.

    Unless, that is, you’re concerned with “pretty”, in which case you bought the wrong gun in the first place.

    (Then again, I’m happy enough with my 870. If I’m ever in a firefight such that I need to change magazines on a shotgun [and where loading individual rounds is a problem – note that with training one can load individual rounds without dismounting the shotgun, but there’s no way you’re doing a mag-change with the Saiga one-handed], I’ve plainly

    A) chosen the wrong weapon, since I should be using a carbine, and

    B) found myself facing a force I have no reasonable chance of success against alone anyway.)

    I lust after a Saiga, but not because I think it’s actually a superior home-defense weapon. But because it’s cool and would blow the hell out of some tin cans.

  6. Chris Byrne Says:

    Steve, I can’t believe no-one has mentioned this, but remember 922r.

    Here’s my post on the subject:

    http://anarchangel.blogspot.com/2006/03/how-not-to-have-your-life-ruined-by.html

  7. Chris Byrne Says:

    Oops that was part one, the stuff relevant to 922r are actually in part 2:

    http://anarchangel.blogspot.com/2006/10/how-not-to-have-your-life-ruined-by.html

    And here’s part 3 just for giggles:

    http://anarchangel.blogspot.com/2007/04/how-not-to-have-your-life-ruined-by.html

  8. Steve H. Says:

    Thanks, Chris. I have to sit down and work all that out. I am conscious of it, but I have been trying not to think about it until the last possible moment.

  9. Steve H. Says:

    I should add that when you convert a Saiga, you generally end up taking off foreign parts and adding American. Every new part I ordered is made in the US.

  10. Chris Byrne Says:

    Absolutely, you just have to make sure that once you are done, you don’t exceed the foreign parts count.

    It’s not hard to do, but it’s important to be certain.